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Acrostics

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Acrostics

Postby xBluxTunicx82 » Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:13 am

Hey everyone, may the blessings of our Father in Heaven be bestowed upon His elect.

I was curious if any of you have done much study into acrostics in our Scripture. I heard Visser and Obie mention in it a recent podcast, and after searching myself, came upon some interesting information.

http://www.bible-codes.org/acrostic_gen ... e-code.htm

This is what I read, and it seems to have a profound connection with Christian Identity if what is written in the 3 layers of the Acrostic are true. Unfortunately, I also saw numerous Jewish sites purporting 'knowledge' of these Acrostics, so I am sceptical to other's translations.

Can anyone tell me if A) Acrostics in our Scripture are real and relevant and B) how are we, as the Bride find and decipher these 'codes' if you will?
James 1:22 - "But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."
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Re: Acrostics

Postby Kentucky » Tue Oct 30, 2012 9:57 am

The link has links to Messianic sites. It uses rabbinic (non-Hebraic) lettering (jewish). When, at the top of the page, the anonymous writer said, "I will be brief" (I'm always a bit leery when no one takes responsibility for a website), it went on forever (lol). I didn't see any connections to Christian Identity. But really, if we don't have a 100% comprehension of the Scriptures as given and received, what do we need codes for... other than making the Bible say things we want to hear. I don't know anybody who has all the answers. Christian Identity has enough things to figure out than to throw this monkey wrench into the works. A novelty at best, but wears thin quickly IMHO.

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Re: Acrostics

Postby xBluxTunicx82 » Tue Oct 30, 2012 4:40 pm

It was this that seemed relevant.. "I will forgive those risen up against me, showing compassion
by lifting up a second time (or, "forgiving again") those who are of dust.
I will be offered up like a fiery bronze serpent or a moth on fire!"

I will receive their (offerings) with rejoicing!
I will look upon them with favor!

I will forgive!

True Christian Israelites are the only 'dust' to be spoken of that I know of. Pastor Visser mentioned that several of the Psalms are acrostic as well, and the fact that 'the knowledge of the mysteries of heaven is given to you, but to them it is not given' causes me to think into things such as this. I mean no harm in the question, only that we in CI have uncovered a 'secret' of sorts. When I first came into the Truth, it was literally mind-blowing, there was so much information that was literally right before my eyes, that my world of 'knowledge' was totally rocked.

Sorry that I didn't look deeper into the sites links provided, I don't trust anything that Jews have to say simply because lying is what they do. Outside of Scripture, an Acrostic is a poem that is written in such a way as to inbed one or several messages within the 'face value' of the text. Yahweh forgive me if I am seeking something that He did not create. But it would seem that part of 'knowledge increasing across the land' would encompass at least the IDEA of acrostics.

I will pray over it Mr. Downey, I appreciate your input as it will weigh on my thoughts as well.
James 1:22 - "But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."
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Re: Acrostics

Postby PastorVisser » Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:16 pm

Acrostics are not "hidden codes" -- they are literary compositions in which the writer has used the letters of the Hebrew alphabet as the initial letters for a sequence of verses.

For example, the use of the fish as a symbol for Jesus Christ from the early days of Christianity to the present time stems ONLY from a Greek acrostic.

They are undoubtedly meant to be known as every "Selah" is still intact in our Bibles.
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Re: Acrostics

Postby Kentucky » Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:48 pm

xBluxTunicx82 wrote:It was this that seemed relevant.. "I will forgive those risen up against me, showing compassion
by lifting up a second time (or, "forgiving again") those who are of dust.
I will be offered up like a fiery bronze serpent or a moth on fire!"

I will receive their (offerings) with rejoicing!
I will look upon them with favor!

I will forgive!

True Christian Israelites are the only 'dust' to be spoken of that I know of.

You know that and I know that, but the people divining the above may have a universalist interpretation of 'dust' leaving it open for misinterpretations.

the fact that 'the knowledge of the mysteries of heaven is given to you, but to them it is not given' causes me to think into things such as this.

Mt. 13:11 says "mysteries of the kingdom of heaven," which would have a different connotation than the 'mysteries of heaven,' which suggests God's abode.

I mean no harm in the question, only that we in CI have uncovered a 'secret' of sorts.

If we were to dabble in things considered secret, we would be accused of being occult or worse. Consider Luke 8:17, "For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad."

But it would seem that part of 'knowledge increasing across the land' would encompass at least the IDEA of acrostics.

Daniel's prophecy did not specify that the increase in knowledge would necessarily be quality knowledge. The internet may be a fulfillment of this increase, but the problem is that there's quite a bit of random or garbage information that is basically worthless knowledge. The parable of the dragnet has the fishers of men throwing out the bad fish. If one googles 'acrostic', the most popular one Christians are fond of is ΙΧΘΥΣ, which means fish, the bumper sticker for Christ. However, if we look a little deeper into what the thought was in the 1st century, the symbol was not fish per se, but rather the dolphin (which isn't a fish at all) and would not be subject to being thrown out of a dragnet. The acrostic would then simply be something coincidental.


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Re: Acrostics

Postby xBluxTunicx82 » Wed Oct 31, 2012 4:05 pm

I do appreciate Luke 8:17 as a reminder of the Truth, as Yahshua told us all things. However, Pastor Visser is right, these are not 'hidden codes' necessarily, but a very clever way to get a message to those with the means to see it. As I said, i am still praying to Yahweh for guidance on the subject, despite all you say, I still feel as though there is meaning to it in relevance to the Israel people. I have asked that it be wiped from my memory and knowledge if it is false, so now I put my faith in the Father and bide in time. Yah bless
James 1:22 - "But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."
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Re: Acrostics

Postby Vandal » Thu Nov 01, 2012 12:33 pm

Bible codes
In Jewish robes
Bewitch the hordes.
Lying Jews
Invent false news.
Christian Men
Avoid such bunk;
Leave it lie.

The first letter of each line forms a word.

The first letter of each line, forms a word, phrase, or sequence. That is all an acrostic is. The mystical idea that the bible is full of hidden and unintentional, supernatural acrostics is Jewish bunk, akin to gematria dementia.
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Re: Acrostics

Postby Kentucky » Thu Nov 01, 2012 1:35 pm

xBluxTunicx82 wrote:I do appreciate Luke 8:17 as a reminder of the Truth, as Yahshua told us all things. However, Pastor Visser is right, these are not 'hidden codes' necessarily, but a very clever way to get a message to those with the means to see it. As I said, i am still praying to Yahweh for guidance on the subject, despite all you say, I still feel as though there is meaning to it in relevance to the Israel people. I have asked that it be wiped from my memory and knowledge if it is false, so now I put my faith in the Father and bide in time. Yah bless

Let me see if I got this right. It's not hidden IF you have the means to see it? From the same link you provided above, they also have a YouTube (please notice the verbiage below the screen): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0FnHl6hOTE

So does this mean there's good acrostics and then there's bad acrostics? What is God's purpose for an acrostic? Wouldn't there be spoilers from the different Bible translations so that not all versions produce the same acrostic? For instance, how would the Christogenea NT compare to the KJV, acrostically speaking?


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Re: Acrostics

Postby xBluxTunicx82 » Fri Nov 02, 2012 12:38 pm

On the contrary, I have just learned of acrostics for the first time in my life. This is not some 'thing' that I am espousing as doctrine. I just wanted to come together and talk about it. Yet, I feel that you are wanting me to argue with you about it, Mark. I will tell you right now, I have read many of your sermons and papers, and listened to a lot as well in my studies into CI.
Maybe acrostics are a lie, maybe they aren't. CI is kind of like a secret... when your eyes are opened to the truth, it is as if a veil is lifted. Being that MANY fall away, then the truth would be as a secret to the masses would it not. Yahshua spoke in parables so that THEY wouldn't understand, isn't that making something a secret?
James 1:22 - "But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."
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Re: Acrostics

Postby Kentucky » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:33 pm

xBluxTunicx82 wrote:On the contrary, I have just learned of acrostics for the first time in my life.

Me too. I had never heard of the word 'acrostic,' although I've heard about acronyms and related word riddles.

This is not some 'thing' that I am espousing as doctrine.

Right. I don't see how it could be something doctrinal, unless one reads more into it than what it is.

I just wanted to come together and talk about it.

Which is why I chimed in.

Yet, I feel that you are wanting me to argue with you about it, Mark.

Not at all. Just because I ask a lot of questions doesn't mean that I'm inviting argumentation. There is no controversy, unless someone takes an 'acrostic' and tries to make dogma out of it, that may not necessarily be in harmony with Scripture. That is a danger don't you agree? When jews divine the words 'holocaust' and 'six million' from these Bible codes, ya gotta wonder if the same thing can be contrived from acrostics. It's not that I'm criticizing you, but sharing with you how that YouTube led to a remark in the comment section that said, "Adam and Eve could not have been Caucasian." Now, we wouldn't make that conclusion (well, maybe some of the crypto-universalists would), but obviously someone has and therefore yet another avenue to Babel-confusion.

Maybe acrostics are a lie, maybe they aren't.

They would appear to be a can of worms, whereupon opening, present itself as problematic. Which is why I asked some of the questions I did out of curiosity. Does it make any difference which Bible is being used? Does it make any difference whether it comes from ancient Hebrew or jewish "Hebrew"? Is it coincidental or divinely intentional? Are we to search for these things or do they just happen? Should they be literal or figurative? If they are just a literary device, what was God's intent and purpose? What is the precise number of acrostics in the Bible? Are any of the acrostics racial? Which is something you gleaned from the first citation dealing with 'dust,' and yet the source didn't. I'm still mulling over why God is forgiving those who rise up against Him ("For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft" I Sam. 15:23; "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these... witchcraft... of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God" Gal. 5:10-21); and if 'dust' is an Adamic reference; and what are the 'offerings' spoken of (if the ordinances were nailed to the Cross)?

CI is kind of like a secret... when your eyes are opened to the truth, it is as if a veil is lifted.

That's a good observation. There are/were mysteries made known by revelation. "Now with ability you are to stand fast in accordance with my good message and the proclamation of Yahshua Christ; in accordance with a revelation of mystery having been kept secret in times eternal" Romans 16:25. "The mystery which has been concealed from the ages and from the races, but now has been made visible to His saints" Col. 1:26. "For I do not wish you to be ignorant, brethren, of this mystery, lest you be wise on account of yourselves, that hardness [blindness KJV]] in part has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Nations arrives" Romans 11:25.

Being that MANY fall away, then the truth would be as a secret to the masses would it not.

Yes, apostasy is racial by nature to obscure the truth. "Your thoughts would be corrupted from that sincerity and that purity [simplicity KJV] which is with the Anointed [Christ]" II Cor. 11:3. When Israel went whoring after strange gods, it was the alien religions of convoluted thought that got them into trouble.

Yahshua spoke in parables so that THEY wouldn't understand, isn't that making something a secret?

Yes, but THEY were not White. The parables, to this day, require study for rightly dividing the word of truth. Christian Identity goes the extra mile to prove who we are and the evidence is in our scholarship. God bless brother.

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