Donald Trump and the Christogenea Debate

[SvenLongshanks]

I thought I would just add some further thoughts on the discussion last night on Christogenea with myself, Brother Ryan and Bill. A couple of points were raised, that I think could do with being clarified.

1.Sons of God. Although the Bible says we are sons of God, that does not mean that we are gods now, or that we have any ability to make ourselves into gods. The serpent tempted Eve with being as a god and the Elohim stated that the tree of Life was being removed from us at that point in time, to prevent this from happening. Ryan quoted a verse saying that the rest of creation yearns for the sons of God to manifest, I believe this is not up to us to manifest, it is up to God to do that in his own time in the day of the Lord. We cannot turn one hair of our heads from grey to blonde, much less become gods by our own devices. Indeed the idea of becoming gods through human will power and aided by supernatural powers is a false gnostic one. Seeds are not trees, although they do contain within them the ability to grow into one, but only when the conditions are fulfilled that God ordained for that to happen. The seed does not make that happen for itself and we cannot say we are gods and more than a seed can say that it is a tree.

2. The kingdom of heaven is within us. Yes, this is within us, but again, this will not be manifest until the day of the Lord. We had our united kingdom that attempted to follow God’s law 4,000 years ago and I dont think that was the kingdom of heaven, that was an earthly kingdom based on God’s laws. It was not possible back then to continue it due to the corruption of creation and it certainly would not be possible now. We have the scripture which tells us the ideal and we should get as close to that as we can in our individual lives, but we will not be able to take over and institute the kingdom of heaven on earth, simply because we are on earth and the earth is corrupt. Once the corruption is gone, once Satan is killed with death itself, earth will be heaven and Christ will be on his throne.

3. We are living in end times, the camp of the saints is surrounded by the armies of Gog and Magog and within ten years the last descendant of David to be on the throne will be King. Somewhere within his lifetime the day of the Lord will occur. We will never get a perfect political leader in that time, but I do believe we have the best that could ever occur within the parameters of the American political system in Donald Trump. I believe he will be used by God to make the next decade or 2 more bearable for us. The Lord does hear our prayers and he does have mercy on his children. I am sure everyone must be aware of what the last trump is, well I for one believe that Heimdal’s horn is called ‘The Donald’.

4. Adolf Hitler spoke a lot about Providence and one of his talents was seizing the chances that providence gave him. We appear to have ignored what providence has given us in Trump and we may have already missed the chance to bring our message to more people by alienating some of the popular sites which did see the potential in Trump, by trying to sabotage their efforts by attacking him. There has been no mention of CI in the media drawing attention to it, but there has been plenty of free advertising for every other part of the Alt-Right.

5. It was asked last night which Trump we should be listening to and quotes from 10, 20 and even 30 years ago were used, to claim that he will go back on what he is saying now. I have watched rallies of his over the last year and longer and his message has been consistent throughout. He is still saying the same now as he was saying a year ago and if anyone watched his Gettysberg address, he outlined exactly what steps he would be taking to achieve those things in the first 100 days of office. I believe he has integrity, the man is risking his very life to try and turn things around. He is a man against time in a similar way to that which Hitler was, but of the only kind possible within today’s world, which has evolved since then into what we have now. The man against time does what he can to turn us back to the golden age, to thwart Satan’s march forward for as long as possible. No Trump wont be able to take us back to a White America, but I do believe he will hold us back from things becoming a lot worse for our people.

If I was an American I would be doing all I could to persuade everyone to vote for Trump, it is the last chance America has to make the last days a little bit more bearable for White people and I for one do not want our people to suffer any more than is necessary.

[Teutonic]

If I was an American I would be doing all I could to persuade everyone to vote for Trump, it is the last chance America has to make the last days a little bit more bearable for White people and I for one do not want our people to suffer any more than is necessary.

Interesting discussion last night, and I think everyone brought up some valid points.

I actually already voted early, and of course I voted for Trump. In my opinion, anything is better than watching that bolshevik hag win the election.

However, I fear that the positive aspect you afford Trump, namely that he might make our last days a little more bearable, is actually a negative. He may very well be a psychological safety valve, designed to keep things comfortable enough for whites to where we dont 'chimp out,' but not too comfortable so that we dont forfeit our lowly status as tax slaves.

[CIman]

Great discussion yesterday! More of that please. Now over to the topic..

If you put your "hope" in Trump that he's going to change everything or start to "make America great again", then you might as well put your "hope" in satan. Trump is a con-artist and Jew-lover who's also--just like Ryan said--been a friend of the Clintons for decades. He also lied during the "Duke-scandal" in february when he said that he "didn't know who Duke is" and that he "refused to denounce him wothout knowing who Duke is" (he's obviously aware of the "racists" that support him, so he treaded very carefully there). It was found out later that he knew who Duke was around the year 2000 and called him a "bigot" and "racist",



And according to himself he tries to (or has commited) commit adultery with other men's wives.

He's a psychopathic liar, fraudster and manipulator. His whole career has consisted of making "business deals" with mobsters and Jews (and all of his kids are married to jews).

[fistofyahweh]

If I do vote, which I'm still wondering if I will, I'd likely vote for Trump.. The idea of putting a god damn communist leaning woman in charge after having 8 years with a communist half Jew/Nigger just doesn't set well with me..

Is Donald Trump a saint? I don't really care.. Will he go back on his promises.. Probably.. But at least that hag known as Hillary won't be in charge.. The global banker elite still plan on crashing the system.. The question is, will Trump do anything about it??

I hope the niggers, spics, shitlibs, SJWs do riot and burn down cities after a Trump win.. Perhaps it will incite the much needed race war that's only been joked about by the so-called White nationalists..

But I suspect it will go on as usual.. Time goes on and the same ol shit will continue.. If Yahweh returns, it'll probably be 1000+ years from now.. We'll all be dead and forgotten, much like our ancestors.. Yahweh started with a single White couple.. perhaps Yahweh has plans for it to end with a single White couple before he intervenes..

[wmfinck]

Sven,

First it is evident that Ryan brought up the "sons of God" because Christians are called to act in that capacity now, and not merely wait for some future utopia. He mentioned the kingdom of heaven being "within" us, and Christians are instructed to seek the Kingdom of Heaven first, and then all of their worldly needs shall be fulfilled.

You have said that "We are living in end times, the camp of the saints is surrounded by the armies of Gog and Magog" and of course all of that is true. But the solution which the Bible offers is not political at all. A president is not going to get us out of this situation. The Scripture informs us that only war and bloodshed are going to get us out of this situation.

Adolf Hitler was a godly Christian man of humble beginnings, living in poverty for much of his life. Donald Trump is a wealthy and corrupt man, who has made his hundreds of millions from the misfortunes and the sins of others. Yahweh uses the first sort as deliverer, and the second sort as a punisher, a pattern found in the Old Testament.

There is no doubt that the Donald Trump candidacy has done much to reveal Jewish treachery, media treachery, the treachery of party politicians, and the hatred in non-Whites to a wide audience of people. But that does not mean that his motives are pro-White, pro-Christian and anti-Devil (Jew).

The White Nationalists have only seen the half of the glass that appeals to them, and they have ignored the other half.

Where Trump has pissed off a lot of progressive Jews, he has pleased conservative Jews in many ways, and has sought to reach out to and comfort them. Are the conservative, capitalist Jews any better than the progressive, Marxist Jews?

Where Trump has talked tough about stemming further illegal immigration, and deporting two million "criminal immigrants", he has not mentioned deporting the tens of millions of aliens who have not yet committed crimes, or who have gained entry through the ridiculously unconstitutional anchor-baby system and other absurd devices touted by the Progressives. His candidacy has, I think, not only pushed this important issue to the back burner, but has rather knocked it off the stove.

Even if Trump follows through on all of his immigration platform, most of his points only uphold existing laws which the past criminal administrations have refused to uphold. But he is not addressing some of the bigger problems that have shifted the demographics of this nation and have also greatly disadvantaged Whites economically.

Illegal immigration was a concern before the 2004 election. And in 2004, the Republicans won the presidency as well as the House and the Senate, which they had control of since 2002, but they did nothing to stop the illegal immigration, never mind reverse it. So there were demonstrations against illegal immigration in 2006 and 2007, and the Republicans lost control of Congress in 2008.

Both of our political parties are filled with Progressives and Capitalists, and the disregard of immigration laws pleases both groups, who will still be around and in power in 4 or 8 years when Donald Trump is gone. They will still be around because the Jewish bankers will still be printing our money.

Trump is no Hitler, who had a much greater transcendental understanding than Trump will ever have, and even Hitler did not go far enough to remove the Jews from Germany. But Hitler understood that if he did not remove both the bankers and the parliament, he would never get anything accomplished.

The Congress may not be able to prevent Trump from enforcing the laws, but they can refuse to fund the agencies that he must use to enforce them, and refuse any new laws. Obama has gotten away with creating law through executive orders, which is unconstitutional, but the issue was never raised because it pleased the Progressives and the Capitalists. The media and the Congress will not let Trump get away with doing that same thing.

As for trade, it would be good if Trump could cancel NAFTA and the TPP, but there are many other aspects of our involvement in globalism that are not being addressed (WTO, GATT). And Trump only wants to cancel those treaties so that he can make "better deals". All new treaties require Congressional approval, and any new tariffs require laws made by Congress or cancelling the treaties will have no actual effect, so the process is not as simple as it sounds.

There are many other elements of the Progressive agenda which Trump has not even addressed, or to which he is even sympathetic.

Many White Nationalists as well as Identity Christians, are enamored with all of the good things which Trump has been saying, but they are all missing the bigger picture. The political process is very slow to put real "change" into effect, and for that reason it is virtually impossible to unwind the Progressive agenda by the means through which it has been advanced.

So Donald Trump may make you all feel good for awhile by alleviating some of the symptoms of parasitic Jewish infestation, but one president is not going to be able to fix anything permanently. Even if he can stop some elements of the Jewish agenda for a short time, the devils will not go away by themselves, and Trump will not outlive them. All of the real problems still persist.

And that last statement purposely ignores a bigger problem: that Trump himself is surrounded by Jews.

It is those real problems which I had tried to address, and instead we got bogged down discussing the symptoms and the temporary elixirs rather than accepting the greater magnitude of the task which ultimately we will be forced to face. As a people constantly seeking temporary political solutions and never addressing the real crux of the issues, we are no better than our ancient ancestors who demanded an earthly king.

If we as Identity Christians are ever going to be relevant to our own cause, then we need to formulate a message which transcends the petty political issues and makes people realize that there is something greater and far more permanent than the temporary bandages offered by engagement in politics.

In pursuit of this greater purpose, in our conversation the other night neither Ryan nor I ever discouraged people from voting for Trump. Rather, it was my intent to show that there were things that we should look for in a Trump victory that are not relevant to Trump's own intentions.

In the Trump speech which you mention, Trump himself called for a "healing of divisions", and in the context of that speech, he meant the divisions between the White and negro races. Those are divisions which we certainly do not want to see healed. How could any White Nationalist miss or ignore that element of his speech is beyond me, but shows that they only listen to what they want to hear.

Rather, in a Trump victory we should hope for further division, and that is the reality which even Trump seems to be purposely ignoring. In our conversation the other night, I had hoped that we could begin to formulate ways to exploit these divisions and present them to Whites who are not yet racially awakened. Or to White Nationalists who are persuaded that Trump is the answer to our woes. But we were bogged down in a debate over the temporary political merits of a Trump victory and lost sight of the greater issues.

Sven, Donald Trump is not a savior. He may slow the globalist and progressive agenda, he may stop Hillary, but he is not going to prevent another Hillary or another Obama from further destroying Christendom in four or eight years. Neither is he going to unwind any of the gains progressives have made in so many other areas. Neither is he going to shine a light on the real devils who have been destroying Christendom. In fat, he may further convince people that there are "good Jews", as he is surrounded by them and his own family is saturated with them.

So I believe you are being short-sighted, because the expression of so much hope in a Donald Trump to repair our plight is not only far too optimistic, but misses an important opportunity to bring an understanding of the much bigger picture to our people.

[wmfinck]

I have NOT yet listened to this myself, but here is Ryan's answer to this forum thread, as he said when he sent me the link:

[SvenLongshanks]

'First it is evident that Ryan brought up the "sons of God" because Christians are called to act in that capacity now, and not merely wait for some future utopia. He mentioned the kingdom of heaven being "within" us, and Christians are instructed to seek the Kingdom of Heaven first, and then all of their worldly needs shall be fulfilled.'

Maybe that could have been made a bit clearer then, because it seemed to me he was saying we are gods and we should be manifesting the kingdom of heaven ourselves, both of which just sounds like a gnostic interpretation of the verses to me.

I dont think Trump is a solution, I just think a starving man should not refuse a morsel of bread and demand caviar instead.

Doing the best people can to sabotage him getting elected because he isnt Christ just seems incredibly stupid to me, especially considering the company that means keeping, when he is obviously being used to help us.

Instead of being 'holier than thou' we should have at the very least not attacked him when he does the right thing. I think CI has lost a huge chance to reach a lot of people by piggy backing on his campaign and instead we have been alienating his supporters, who are actually the people most likely to be receptive to our message.

[Staropramen]

Indeed the idea of becoming gods through human will power and aided by supernatural powers is a false gnostic one.

Human will power, in this case is about as useful as it is when we have diarrhea. And much messier.

[Staropramen]

4. Adolf Hitler spoke a lot about Providence and one of his talents was seizing the chances that providence gave him. We appear to have ignored what providence has given us in Trump and we may have already missed the chance to bring our message to more people by alienating some of the popular sites which did see the potential in Trump, by trying to sabotage their efforts by attacking him. There has been no mention of CI in the media drawing attention to it, but there has been plenty of free advertising for every other part of the Alt-Right.

Yeah but Sven, that's because much of the Alt-Right is jewish rabbit holes to drive Whites away from the truth. I once posted the following and Bill also quoted this during a podcast;

White Nationalism is itself jewish. It's a kosher rabbit hole for racists. When a follower of say Alex Jones realizes that racism is healthy and tries to break away the jew has David Duke and Don Black right there ready to greet them with open arms. Jews want to gather together all the non-white races against White people. We are supposed to trust Yahweh and be a separate people but WNs would rather gather together all the non-whites against the jews! They take their script from the jews! Jews have success because of our disobedience, not because this game plan of theirs is a good one. WNs don't understand this so they figure that the jewish plan is a good one and they'll use it against them. Whites without Christ equals failure regardless of strategy.

Nothing we could ever do would garner media attention. Except becoming compromised.

[fistofyahweh]

I have NOT yet listened to this myself, but here is Ryan's answer to this forum thread, as he said when he sent me the link:

It all sounds good until you get into the spiritual stuff... Which sounds like StarWars Jedi Mind Trick ****.

Let the spirit flow through you, think in a spiritual way, think upon the things that are unseen.... yadda yadda yadda...

Maybe it's just me, but why the hell would a intelligent creator bother to create something physical out of matter, in the image of himself, give it 5 senses to operate in the physical world, and then tell that creation to trust upon a realm that he can not see, hear, touch, taste, or feel?? That has always come across as illogical to me..

How does a physical being have a relationship with something that isn't physical??