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Curiosities

Old Testament religious discussion apart from Biblical history

Curiosities

Postby aleajactaest » Thu Apr 17, 2014 4:44 pm

1 Kings 12_28 -- Exodus 32_4.pdf
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I am currently investigating all the Hebrew words for God, Yahweh, etc for the 3rd time and I already know it will not be the last time.

When I received the last Saxon Messenger, I took a break and read the William's article ""... Amos ... 7"".
At the very end of it, the very last sentence reads as follows
Therefore the term winter house and summer house may be allegorical references to the northward and southward towns of Dan and Bethel, which are locations of the golden calves of Jeroboam.

and that's fine.

But what triggered my mind are the words ""the golden calves of Jeroboam"".
This is in 1 King 12:28 and reminded me of Exodus 32:4.

Upon rereading once again those 2 verses within their respective chapters (for contest) and a bit elsewhere, I sensed that there is something funny about them.
I verified their respective Hebrew words to ensure that the translation was OK.

Can you sense that something is funny as I did?

SEE ATTACHMENT.
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Re: Curiosities

Postby wmfinck » Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:12 pm

Jeroboam made the claim, but that does not make it true, that the calves had brought Israel out of Egypt. Rather, he was instituting paganism and a new priesthood because he understood that was necessary to maintain control of the people.

The institution of paganism as a state religion always necessitates lies. We see that in our own recent history, except that today governments are more sophisticated, LOL.

But what does Jeroboam's institution of calf-worship in the divided kingdom have to do with the names/titles for Yahweh God? You lost me.
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Re: Curiosities

Postby aleajactaest » Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:02 pm

Jeroboam made the claim, but that does not make it true, that the calves had brought Israel out of Egypt.

That's right.
But then neither Aaron 's claim makes it true, which is identical to the one of Jeroboam in the last 6 words of both verses.

What I find funny is the blatant grammatical error in Exodus 32:4 :

one (singular) calf identified by (plural) gods

which is not the case in 1 Kings 12:28 :

two (plural) calves identified by (plural) gods,

remembering that, in both cases, "gods = elohim" refer to pagan gods NOT to the ELOHIM.
Rather, he was instituting paganism and a new priesthood because he understood that was necessary to maintain control of the people.

And he had a personal valid reason even though he screwed up big time.
Paganism is never right but Israel has been suffering big time under Solomon 's reign.
And Rehoboam, after taking the advice of some young anal sphincters, answered the Israelites that he would rule them even harsher than his father did. --- Read 1 King 12.
But what does Jeroboam's institution of calf-worship in the divided kingdom have to do with the names/titles for Yahweh God? You lost me.
As the "motto" says:
one wrong name/title for Yahweh/God is one wrong name/title for Yahweh/God too much.
[ Please, forgive me if I don't trust jews ]

The second thing I find funny is the fact that, eventually, Jeroboam was rightly punished by Yahweh, while Aaron was NEVER punished for his action in Exodus 32.
NEITHER when he rebelled against Moses in Numbers 12 where his wife Miriam was punished instead.
I wonder why.
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Re: Curiosities

Postby wmfinck » Mon Apr 21, 2014 4:02 pm

Aaron's claim was made by Moses, and was pious. Jereoboam was departing into paganism and forcing the tribes to follow, which was impious. The two had entirely different motives.

Yet since neither man wrote the words himself, that is also immaterial.

What is material is the plural of majesty, which appears throughout ancient inscriptions relating to pagan gods as well as to Yahweh. Please investigate that and perhaps you shall see an alternate, more innocent, perspective of your point of contention.
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Re: Curiosities

Postby aleajactaest » Sat Apr 26, 2014 4:52 pm

PLURALIS MAJESTATIS.pdf
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William said
What is material is the plural of majesty, which appears throughout ancient inscriptions relating to pagan gods as well as to Yahweh.
It is since 1969 that I have been hearing about pluralis majestatis, and that can be just fine.
However, sometime, scriptures show something different as in, for example, Genesis 20:13 and 35:7 where the subject God = Elohim has a predicate (verb) in a plural person.

See attachment.

Mind that I can't find a scripture with Yahweh as subject having the predicate in the plural.
Apparently, the pluralis majestatis applies only to God = Elohim.
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Re: Curiosities

Postby Filidh » Sat Apr 26, 2014 9:24 pm

alea, have you ever been by yourself, working on a project, and said to yourself "alright, let's see what we are able to do here?"?
real name's trevor :-)
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Re: Curiosities

Postby aleajactaest » Sun Apr 27, 2014 2:37 pm

alea, have you ever been by yourself, working on a project, and said to yourself "alright, let's see what we are able to do here?"?

Every day . . . and by the end of the day it's either a failure or it's inconclusive.
Even if I live for a million years, I will never get something done. WHY?
If you are one of those humbly and truly researching, I am happy to know you do.
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Re: Curiosities

Postby Filidh » Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:13 pm

all i was saying is that maybe yahweh said to himself in that same way, "well, let's make man in our image", exactly as one individual may say "let's see what we are able to do here".

edited for clarity.
real name's trevor :-)
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