All Seed of Israel, Fornication and Judgement

[Joe]

Hey Lang, what is your interpretation of Ezra's account? What about Judah?

esau was unrepentant, his tree, his family line, he, became a broken cistern. God knew what he would become before he was born. esau never even acknowledged the sin, and seemed incapable of doing so because he also sold his birth-right without a care. Perhaps those who were given over to sin, our people who were lost in pagan/mongrelized nations, had a similar attitude. paganism and idol worship has always had race-mixing elements.

But those who are repentant, like Judah and Ezra, must be preserved by God, their racial purity may be guarded by God.

[Staropramen]

Hey Lang, what is your interpretation of Ezra's account? What about Judah?

esau was unrepentant, his tree, his family line, he, became a broken cistern. God knew what he would become before he was born. esau never even acknowledged the sin, and seemed incapable of doing so because he also sold his birth-right without a care. Perhaps those who were given over to sin, our people who were lost in pagan/mongrelized nations, had a similar attitude. paganism and idol worship has always had race-mixing elements.

But those who are repentant, like Judah and Ezra, must be preserved by God, their racial purity may be guarded by God.

Are you saying Esau himself became a broken cistern? That's impossible. You can only be born a broken cistern.

[Staropramen]

Staropramen, I didn't mean to offend you.

I wasn't offended.

[Joe]

Staropramen says

Are you saying Esau himself became a broken cistern? That's impossible. You can only be born a broken cistern.

I was trying to say that because he was careless he was destined be the father of a broken 'race'. To compare the way Ezra and Judah were repentant and their family line/tree was preserved, while esau's family line was corrupted because of his nature. You are right, I should not have said that he was a broken cistern, I apologise, I just wanted to try and say that his careless nature lead to that, is reflected in that.

I also said that pagans who did not care for God were more likely to given-up to sin, to beget mongrels, as paganism/idolatry leads to race-mixing.

Then I extended this idea to say that God may protect the God-fearing's racial purity, I know Isaac was hurt when esau sinned. But God did preserve Jacob, lead him to a good wife.

This is conjecture, and would require more study on the 'God preserving us' assertion. But you yourself were lead to realizations because of your faith, you could have gone a different path if you didn't fear God. I still have much reading to do, I haven't finished the Bible once yet, I am moving at a snail's pace, constantly checking commentaries, so please understand that I am trying to conform myself to Scripture, but may sometimes make mistake on what Scripture says.

Again Joseph said to his brothers: “Come near to me that I may speak with you. I am Joseph your brother whom ye sold into Egypt. Be not troubled in your heart for all that which you have done; be not angry with yourselves for selling me hither, for Yahweh sent me before you to preserve a posterity (race) in the earth and save our family (tree) alive. It was not you that sent me to this place, but Yahweh; He has made me a father to Pharaoh, an overseer of his house; and ruler throughout Egypt. Two years of the famine are past and there are five years remaining with no earing or harvest. Go now in haste and bring hither my father and all his family with him. Tell him, thus saith thy son Joseph, Yahweh hath made me master of all Egypt; come down to me and tarry not.”

http://emahiser.christogenea.org/watchm ... march-2001

Gen 45:7 And God sent me before you to preserve you a posterity in the earth, and to save your lives by a great deliverance.
Exo 32:13-14 I will greatly multiply your seed as the stars of heaven for multitude, and all this land which thou spokest of to give to them, so that they shall possess it for ever. 14 And the Lord was prevailed upon to preserve his people.
Pro 2:8 that he may guard the righteous ways: and he will preserve the way of them that fear him.

[Lang]

Hey Lang, what is your interpretation of Ezra's account? What about Judah?

I read something about Judah marrying a caananite woman but I don't know much about the subject, really.

[Staropramen]

Staropramen says

Are you saying Esau himself became a broken cistern? That's impossible. You can only be born a broken cistern.

I was trying to say that because he was careless he was destined be the father of a broken 'race'. To compare the way Ezra and Judah were repentant and their family line/tree was preserved, while esau's family line was corrupted because of his nature. You are right, I should not have said that he was a broken cistern, I apologise, I just wanted to try and say that his careless nature lead to that, is reflected in that.

I also said that pagans who did not care for God were more likely to given-up to sin, to beget mongrels, as paganism/idolatry leads to race-mixing.

Then I extended this idea to say that God may protect the God-fearing's racial purity, I know Isaac was hurt when esau sinned. But God did preserve Jacob, lead him to a good wife.

This is conjecture, and would require more study on the 'God preserving us' assertion. But you yourself were lead to realizations because of your faith, you could have gone a different path if you didn't fear God. I still have much reading to do, I haven't finished the Bible once yet, I am moving at a snail's pace, constantly checking commentaries, so please understand that I am trying to conform myself to Scripture, but may sometimes make mistake on what Scripture says.

No need to apologise , we're here to help each other understand!

[Joe]

@Staropramen
I just wanted it clear that I don't think and wouldn't call you a broken cistern. I would also be honoured to be least in the Kingdom, even to just see His Kingdom would be enough for me. Not to be first, as the last; but because that is where I belong.

Just wanted to add these papers to the discussion. I know, anyone can find them, but I enjoyed the first one and am getting to the second.

Unforgivable Sin, Step By Step Explanation
http://emahiser.christogenea.org/unforg ... xplanation

The Unpardonable Sin
http://emahiser.christogenea.org/unpardonable-sin

[Nayto]

Finally managed to give those links a read, although not as thorough a read as I'd like and not as comprehensive a response as they probably deserve, so apologies there.

I'm just not convinced though that race mixing is unpardonable. It all hinges on Christ talking to an audience of mongrel pharisees and He continues to say that if you make a good tree then the fruit is good, but a bad tree will have bad fruit. To me, if anything other than a cryptic damnation of the audience, He is referring to their being mongrels. You are right that there is no covenant with a mongrel, but it seems like Christ did not want to say it outright to them. He said it cryptically just like his condemnation of Nicodemus, who Christ also accused of being a mongrel and could not be saved. In His wisdom He said these things in a manner that His sheep would understand, but not the mongrels.

I mean, Esra seems to support the idea of absolution after race mixing. Corporate Israel was forgiven for race mixing. Make no mistake, it is probably the most severe sin, but we should be glad for those who are redeemed from this sin, and they themselves should be glad if they are able to free themselves of it. Like Christ said, the greater the sin, the greater the joy of true repentance and forgiveness.

[Joe]

I just wanted to add, that being a street-sweep for Christ in the days to come would be better than this life or anything this life can offer. Praise Christ. (In response to Staro's idea about being least in the Kingdom).

@Nayto, you mean Lang's links. Clifton has the same view as you, saying that the products of race-mixing would be destroyed. Also I made a mistake, fornication refers to race-mixing, adultery refers to race-mixing and other kinds of sexual sin.

[Nayto]

@Nayto, you mean Lang's links. Clifton has the same view as you, saying that the products of race-mixing would be destroyed. Also I made a mistake, fornication refers to race-mixing, adultery refers to race-mixing and other kinds of sexual sin.

Yep! Although I skimmed over yours, hopefully I will get to read it in depth soon. There is some valuable information in there and truth be told, I have never read Emahizer's stuff before.