Rapture Doctrine

[Lang]

I never believed on the "rapture of the church before the tribulation" thing because it's too unrealistic to me, but I could not prove wrong either. But today I was so annoyed with my mother talking about the rapture that I decided to read about it. It was great reading and now the Bible is making even more sense to me. This had a great effect on my mother's mind as well. She saw the logic and now she changed her discurse to "whatever if christians or wicked are removed from earth, I'm happy".

So I want to share this amazing article here on Christogenea.

Here it is:

The Rapture of the Wicked.pdf

(103.49 KiB) Downloaded 246 times

In short, the main passages to support rapture teachers are 1 Thes 4:16, 17 and Jude 14 and 15. For the first, the key to demystify the rapture doctrine is the "to meet the Lord" passage, where the "to meet", in greek "apantesis", means receive a special one and escort him into your city, your country, etc. So we are not goint to meet Him in the clouds to go to Heaven, but to escort and receive Him on earth. For the second, the people who are taken away are referred to in the plural, while the people who are left here are referred to in the singular. As they were talking about Noah individually and the wicked in a comparison of Christ's 2nd coming and the flood day, probably the left is Noah and the taken away are the wicked, unless it's a gross grammatical mistake. So the rapture would actually be the rature of the wicked, not the rapture of the church. The parable of the taras and the wheat supports this view. Moreover, the God's chosen are Israel, not the church, Israel is the body and God is the head, Israel is the bride and God is the bridegroom. So there's no such a thing as "the church" being saved.

[Joe]

Thank-you ...this sounds interesting.

[Staropramen]

I never had a problem with "the rapture" as far as God being able to do something like that. Once I learned that it is not sound doctrine I rejected it on that basis.

[Nayto]

I never had a problem with "the rapture" as far as God being able to do something like that. Once I learned that it is not sound doctrine I rejected it on that basis.

Same here. I even read some of the "Left Behind" series in my early teens. I must say though, my family is waking up to this lie and admittedly not all due to me. Word seems to be getting around...

[Kentucky]

So I want to share this amazing article here on Christogenea.

Here it is:

The Rapture of the Wicked.pdf

It's a good little booklet that I've had in my library for over 30 years. The "apprentice pastor" was Stephen Jones before he became a full blown universalist. Perhaps a better book (that I received around the same time circa 1970's) and larger volume was 'The Rapture of the Saints' by Duncan McDougall. I found a free PDF at the Sheldon Emry Memorial Library: http://www.sheldonemrylibrary.com/Raptu ... Saints.pdf

Another book that I haven't read, but have heard good reviews, is 'I Want to be Left Behind' by CI Pastor Ron Poch. Poch was the pastor at America's Promise for about a year, between Ben Williams and Dave Barley. I love the title, which alludes to Tim Lehay's "Left Behind' monstrosity. http://www.artisanpublishers.com/want-l ... 25677.html

Mark

[2ndWitness]

So there's no such a thing as "the church" being saved.

"For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."(1 Thessalonians 4)

"And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, And sware by Him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as He hath declared to His servants the prophets."(Revelation 10)

"Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory."(1 Corinthians 15)

"The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in My right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. . . . And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive; I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan. Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death. . . . And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth; I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept My word, and hast not denied My name. Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Because thou hast kept the word of My patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of My God, and the name of the city of My God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from My God: and I will write upon him My new name. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches."(Revelation 1, 2, 3)

"And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. . . . And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. . . . And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. . . . And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations."(Revelation 11, 12, 13)

"And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come: and worship Him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters."(Revelation 14)
(all underline added for emphasis)

[Joe]

There are many CI papers on this subject.
But remember, the tares are gathered first and burned.

There are many links in this thread, where we discuss the rapture, starting with the third post down.
viewtopic.php?f=36&t=5347&hilit=rapture&start=120

[2ndWitness]

the tares are gathered first and burned.

What do you do with the Revelation 14 verses, Joe?

"And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs."

[Joe]

^This is exactly what Bill was talking about.
The condescending attitude, the belief that she can refute Scripture with Scripture, as if God's word can somehow contradict itself. And that Scripture doesn't even contradict what I was saying at all.

I just wish she had used her time more wisely and learned that Scripture does not contradict itself ...then she could have learned much more. But I suspect she wasn't here to learn, in her welcome she said she would do this until she got suspended.